My .02 on the 920T/930T - federal agent

[sageuvagony]

For new units, memory is cheap - $2 a GB when it's built in - so that's not a limit. In the map section, TT says: "Depending on the map you purchase, additional memory (e.g. an empty SD card) might be needed." And When I go to download a map, TT instructions include "Also, make sure your memory card (SD card) has enough space." TT home knows what your unit can hold and if it has card in the slot. TT knows, the customer knows (probably got the 920 to put an SD card with music in it), and TT Home knows all about SD cards, so it's not about the memory. TT has made map choices based on other things, but I don't really know, and they don't tell us.




Yes, or offered a low cost subscription like they do in Europe. I think they are still trying to figure out the best way to make money from their maps, and I hope they find out that $110 for ONE map is a non-starter.

The map prices are just flat out stupid. Especially when your area is pretty well covered on the map. I sure as hell will not pay for a map. When I finally do decide on a new map(maybe a year from now) I will most likely buy a new unit and get the latest map that way. The prices on these units have dropped a lot. Hell, you can buy a refurbished TomTom ONE for $79.99 with 1 year warranty. The map costs more than the unit!

I understand that back then, TomTom used to have to pay license fees to TeleAtlas for each map they gave out. Now that TomTom owns TeleAtlas, I'm assuming they don't have to pay anyone now do they?

All of us should seriously start emailing TomTom requesting a subscription plan for those of us not in Europe.


And as far as selecting a map, you cannot choose your own map, even if you have 999999GB of free space. TomTom will only sell you the map made for your unit series. If we were able to choose our own maps, TomTom ONE users would be using "North America" maps. TomTom ONE users would have been able to use map 810. In order to use map 810, you needed NavCore 8.010, which ONE models did have. ONE models use the stripped down version of the North America map which is called "USA & CANADA" regardless of how much space you have available. At one point people back then DID use North America maps on the ONE models, but TomTom didn't like that, so now they only let you install maps via TomTom Home. These are all choices of TomTom on what they WANT us to have.

Electronic manufacturers will always purposely use older/obsolete/limited components on lower-end models. Not only to keep costs down, but to make sure there are differences between their low-end and high-end models. Sure, it might only cost TomTom 1 more dollar (or even way less) to add 8GB of internal memory to ONE models, but this would destroy sales on higher end models. TomTom uses USB 1.1 on purpose on the ONE models. I'm pretty sure it wouldn't cost more to use USB 2.0 instead, but again, they do this on purpose.

If you want better features, they expect you to fork out extra money. It's all part of business.

 

[Gilbert]

Sage,

I agree with most of what you wrote. While TT bought TA, they have not merged the companies and TA stays a separate commercial entity and am sure they are still paying some money to TA for the licence. I'm sure their accountants have worked on a price that will work best for both and doubt this will ever be made public.

As for the USB standard of ONE vs GO models, it is a matter of the highly integrated Samsung chipsets (2 different ones) which have some different characteristics. Those Samsung chipsets are also used by different manufacturers of automotive gps devices. The chipset controls pretty much everything: memory, clock, integrated cpu, dma, gps receiver, display, i/o etc. Samsung also makes the touch screen displays and supplies the gps receiver chip. TT only needs to supply the cases, maps and sw and even there, you will notice it licences or gets much of it from outside such as TTS and AVR from Loquendo.

As any business, they like to charge as much as it can for what it offers. As for maps, they are not the highest. Just loook at what car manufacturers charge for their yearly map. Most charge more than you paid for your refurbished GO 720! When I was shopping for a gps, I could have gotten a used unit such what comes from my car's manufacturer but after enquiries noticed their maps were quite incomplete for NA and were not quite up-to-date while the unit, even on eBay, was rather more expensive than most hand helds. It was also not as flexible (no user POIs) and you can't navigate while the car is moving.

 

[canderson]

While TT bought TA, they have not merged the companies and TA stays a separate commercial entity and am sure they are still paying some money to TA for the licence. I'm sure their accountants have worked on a price that will work best for both and doubt this will ever be made public.

Both are, as you say, separate entities still. However, they are both still publicly traded companies. I'm sure you'll find the details available with some searching.

 

[Gilbert]

Both are, as you say, separate entities still. However, they are both still publicly traded companies. I'm sure you'll find the details available with some searching.

If I saw the details, publicly available, I would not trust what I would see. Thru my life in computers, a lot of it in large companies, I've seen my share of data manipulation before the information was made public. Can you remember sales figures of Nortel before the the techno bust? Nortel is still trying to figure out what the real numbers are all about! That is only one example out of too many and there are some that did not get their hands slapped for massaging financial info. Most companies don't want the truth to come out. I've seen invoices with the correct number of items multiplied by the official price followed by a second page showing a discount for exceeding a set quantity followed by a third page allowing another discount for being a priviledged customer with a final invoice amount quite different from the first page and a payment request for some futuristic date without interest! There are so many ways to massage data that it's not even funny...

 

[Arno]

I've seen invoices with the correct number of items multiplied by the official price followed by a second page showing a discount for exceeding a set quantity followed by a third page allowing another discount for being a priviledged customer with a final invoice amount quite different from the first page and a payment request for some futuristic date without interest!

And that, folks, is how come you've seen these New Car Dealer adverts for years 100 DOLLAR OVER FACTORY INVOICE

 

[Targonis]

The map prices are just flat out stupid. Especially when your area is pretty well covered on the map. I sure as hell will not pay for a map. When I finally do decide on a new map(maybe a year from now) I will most likely buy a new unit and get the latest map that way. The prices on these units have dropped a lot. Hell, you can buy a refurbished TomTom ONE for $79.99 with 1 year warranty. The map costs more than the unit!

I understand that back then, TomTom used to have to pay license fees to TeleAtlas for each map they gave out. Now that TomTom owns TeleAtlas, I'm assuming they don't have to pay anyone now do they?

All of us should seriously start emailing TomTom requesting a subscription plan for those of us not in Europe.


And as far as selecting a map, you cannot choose your own map, even if you have 999999GB of free space. TomTom will only sell you the map made for your unit series. If we were able to choose our own maps, TomTom ONE users would be using "North America" maps. TomTom ONE users would have been able to use map 810. In order to use map 810, you needed NavCore 8.010, which ONE models did have. ONE models use the stripped down version of the North America map which is called "USA & CANADA" regardless of how much space you have available. At one point people back then DID use North America maps on the ONE models, but TomTom didn't like that, so now they only let you install maps via TomTom Home. These are all choices of TomTom on what they WANT us to have.

Electronic manufacturers will always purposely use older/obsolete/limited components on lower-end models. Not only to keep costs down, but to make sure there are differences between their low-end and high-end models. Sure, it might only cost TomTom 1 more dollar (or even way less) to add 8GB of internal memory to ONE models, but this would destroy sales on higher end models. TomTom uses USB 1.1 on purpose on the ONE models. I'm pretty sure it wouldn't cost more to use USB 2.0 instead, but again, they do this on purpose.

If you want better features, they expect you to fork out extra money. It's all part of business.

What you forget is that not everyone buys the cheapest GPS out there. The same applies to computers and everything else, you MUST compare the value of what you have to the price to repair/update it and then to the cost of something new.

The 920 and 930 for example are $400+ units, so paying $109 for a map update will be cheaper than buying a new GPS with the same quality/features. You see the same thing with computers, where if you paid $500 for a computer four years ago, the current value is down to $100, so do you pay more than that for parts/labor?

In addition to this, you need to look at the features the new maps provide. The whole reason for the 815 map set compared to the 810 maps was the IQ routing feature previously only counted the day of the week and did not take the time of day into account. The 815 map set(which needs the 8.3 firmware) takes the time of day into account, so things like rush hour and the direction of traffic will be planned for in the routing. Is it worth it for you to get this feature(if your GPS even supports the feature)?

Even things like map share were new features at one time and required at least the 675 map version to work. For some people, the ability to correct map errors on their device(even if you don't get updates from Home) would have been worth the money.

I am not saying that map updates are the best solution for everyone, but there are good reasons why the price might be worth it for SOME people. Tomtom normally has a sale on maps in January, and for some people, it will be worth waiting for.

 

[m0j0]

Okay,

More on the 920T/930T. For some reason my traffic infomation is becoming much more reliable. It is getting to me quicker and the info appears to be more accurate. Does anyone know why that might be?

Still having sporadic problems with locating addresses every now and then. Problem being 1) you must know prior to searching what city your address is in or you will show no address found. 2) POI's that are based solely on the address (not GPS coordinates) are sometimes off by as much as a 1/4 mile.

That said I gave up the Garmin 205 mainly because it doesn't have traffic. The G purchased a Garmin 765T for me. I'll give you a side by side comparison when I get it.

later

 

[schneid]

As an Ex-Fed

who still dabbles, I do all my lead planning in Streets and Trips and save the .est file. I then use POIConverter to change that to an .ov2 that I pass on to TT.

Doing this allows me to see where I am going on a bigger map. Streets will also optimize the stops if you want and that can be passed as an .itn. If Streets shows an address to be in the middle of the desert or in a pond, I know something is wrong. It is much easier to error check at your desk than on the road.

Another trick I've learned is to set an alarm for my leads at 2-5 miles. If I am I heading to another a lead, I will be dinged that another lead is on my intended route allowing me to knock it off.

Having used TT for five years, I consider Streets and Trips a must have companion. It's cheap too. When I head out on a big road trip, I run Streets with GPS enabled on a laptop so that always have the big picture too.

 

[Targonis]

Okay,

More on the 920T/930T. For some reason my traffic infomation is becoming much more reliable. It is getting to me quicker and the info appears to be more accurate. Does anyone know why that might be?

Still having sporadic problems with locating addresses every now and then. Problem being 1) you must know prior to searching what city your address is in or you will show no address found. 2) POI's that are based solely on the address (not GPS coordinates) are sometimes off by as much as a 1/4 mile.

That said I gave up the Garmin 205 mainly because it doesn't have traffic. The G purchased a Garmin 765T for me. I'll give you a side by side comparison when I get it.

later

As time goes on, more and more people are reporting traffic conditions, and there are more, not less sources of traffic/weather data, which DO make their way from one provider to another. The servers do seem to be a bit more responsive now that the holidays are over, so that probably helps a bit as well.